CEWindows.net posts screenshots of WM2003 SE

[bkbroil]

CEWindows.net has always been a great resource for finding drivers and troubleshooting ActiveSync problems. Now Chris De Herrera has posted a slew of screen shots of WM2003SE. I don't see too much of a change other than the landscape shots of WMP and the some of the other applications.
What do you think? Will you be upgrading as soon as it comes out?

[jtice]

I was VERY happy to see a post today that Toshiba will release 2003 for the e800, which is on its way to me right now.
I will upgrade, I figure there are a few new features I can use.
Plus maybe more builtin drivers.
Is there any word on wether it will support VGA mode better yet?

[bkbroil]

Where's that post? How do I get my hands on it? (I have a Toshiba e805)

[hawkmankt]

are they going to have the upgrade available for the HP 1945 now?
I just freaking bought the thing.

[jkendrick]

Originally Posted by hawkmankt

are they going to have the upgrade available for the HP 1945 now?
I just freaking bought the thing.

I read somewhere that the ROM on the 194x is not big enough for the upgrade.

[jkendrick]

Notice how USELESS landscape will be on QVGA devices with the on-screen keyboard?

[bkbroil]

Notice how USELESS landscape will be on QVGA devices with the on-screen keyboard?

QVGA??......What's QVGA?........Oh yeah....I remember that...Do they still make that? I thought they went out with Commodore 64s. (I only use QVGA to go into Pocket MVP to watch movies...that's it...)

[jkendrick]

Hey bk, better watch yourself. WM SE might just turn your VGA screen into a real QVGA one!

[bkbroil]

Hey bk, better watch yourself. WM SE might just turn your VGA screen into a real QVGA one!

Is that true? Do you know of anyone on your site that has played around with WM2003SE? Will I lose the VGA? Doh! I didn't even think of that, I guess Resfix may not work with WM2003SE.....I'm holding off until I hear that somebody has sucessfully migrated.

[jkendrick]

There's a huge debate waging among e800 owners as we speak. The problem stems around the fact that the menu bars and system dialogs and controls will be the same physical size on the screen in both QVGA and VGA. There's no question that current VGA users (e800) will lose screen real estate under SE.
Hopefully most apps will be adapted to the new OS and allow user control over font sizes since the OS only allows 5 generic font size settings. Since most devices are still QVGA you can bet the OS will be geared to displaying everything on those screens. Look carefully at the PI screen images- according to the PI folks they were made in VGA under SE using very small fonts. They display a lot less information than I can currently display on the e800.
Many users have said they will wait and see about the upgrade when it's available. Toshiba historically does not provide a way back to the old OS with their updates.

[jtice]

Heres one post about 2003 for the e800.
Thats not the one i saw though, cant seem to find it.
http://www.pocketpctools.com/modules...e7d17838a4dd55

[jkendrick]

Originally Posted by bkbroil

Is that true? Do you know of anyone on your site that has played around with WM2003SE? Will I lose the VGA? Doh! I didn't even think of that, I guess Resfix may not work with WM2003SE.....I'm holding off until I hear that somebody has sucessfully migrated.

Resfix? What's that?

[bkbroil]

Resfix? What's that?

Doh! I meant MyVGA....MyVGA replaced ResFix....My Bad.
From the MyVGA Installation Docs:
Installing over ResFix
Do backup.
Run ResFix and select standard QVGA-Portrait video mode, reboot.
Uninstall ResFix.
You can also uninstall VB-Runtime if no one of installed programs require it.
Copy MyVGA.exe at Pocket PC in any location.
Run MyVGA.exe and select any of available video modes.

[jkendrick]

Made you look.

[jtice]

AH ha,
Here is the post about 2003 release for Toshiba.
http://discussion.brighthand.com/sho...hreadid=103507

[knelson]

I would upgrade but HP said no to 3950 owners... which means I will not be looking at HP for my next machine.

[jkendrick]

I hope everyone realizes the size of the update in ROM will affect which devices can have the upgrade. On the beta versions of SE the OS took over 24 mb of ROM. While the final version will probably be somewhat smaller than this it's pushing the limits for older devices.

[knelson]

I believe the 3950 has 32 ROM

[kamikun]

After looking at those pictures count me in the crowd that feels... slightly underwhelmed. Hopefully, the new OS will allow you to adjust your system font sizes to "near-MyVGA levels." Moving from VGA to faux-QVGA with high resolution ain't my idea of an upgrade.
I think I'll sit out the first round of upgrading and see how people cope with the new bar sizes and pixel-doubling. If it all shakes out well, WisBar and other apps will allow you to retool your machine back to the beauty of VGA mode, but if not... I think I'll be sticking with what I got.

[jkendrick]

Alex Kac, the author of PI, has been debating e800 owners for a while now about this. His point, from the developer's POV, is that they must develop apps for the largest user base which is QVGA. He's right and until there are more VGA devices installed that's the way it's going to be.
We just have to depend on some utilities (perhaps MyVGA?) that can re-enable the lost VGA functions in SE. It could happen but who knows? I've been trying to get a copy of SE from MS & Toshiba for weeks now so we can look at it for just this purpose. But it's apparent that won't happen and we will have to get it when it's released so there will at the very least be an extended period when you either put up with what you get in SE or delay upgrading.
The only thing that SE brings to QVGA users is landscape which to me is just useless in low res.

[Brad Isaac]

Originally Posted by jkendrick

We just have to depend on some utilities (perhaps MyVGA?) that can re-enable the lost VGA functions in SE. It could happen but who knows? I've been trying to get a copy of SE from MS & Toshiba for weeks now so we can look at it for just this purpose. But it's apparent that won't happen and we will have to get it when it's released so there will at the very least be an extended period when you either put up with what you get in SE or delay upgrading.

I've been looking closely at the Toshiba e8xx models and been tempted to buy, buy, BUY!! But there is that little nagging about "what if" MS turns the tables and in SE or whatever changes the screen access specs?

[jkendrick]

Brad,
I don't think that's a worry point as Toshiba is going to provide the update for free. Any issues they might have will surely be addressed in the update.
My feeling is that once SE is released a lot of buyers who have been scared of the e800 (due to lack of OS support) will start snapping them and the rumored e830 up. They're already hard to find now but if you can find one I'd sure get it if I could.

[jkendrick]

One other point- OEMs like Toshiba have had access to the SE betas since BEFORE the e800 was released.

[sracer]

I have yet to see a substantive explanation as to the benefits of a VGA PPC. They've all been of the "it's kewl!" "it's l33t!" "it rox!" variety.
I've had the opportunity to try a VGA Toshiba PPC and I was underwhelmed by it. Sure the image is sharper, but all of the controls and icons are microscopic on it. For applications that can be skinned, VGA resolution means that all graphic files must be 4x larger. That can add up to quite a bit. Video playback of existing low-res files looked WORSE than on QVGA...requiring higher bitrate files to achieve the same visual quality... again, higher bitrate, larger filesizes.
The quality of that VGA screen is at the expense of memory (storage and operating).
I don't see how the inclusion of integrated landscape mode increases the appeal of VGA PPCs.
As for WM2003SE, it is too little too late. This should've been released last year as WM2003. Accessory manufacturers should've been given a heads-up so that they could produce peripherals, especially external keyboards that could exploit the landscape orientation.
Based on all of the software and drivers that broke with the release of WM2003, I get the impression that MS is simply doing what they want without giving developers and manufacturers an adequate "heads-up".
And are those users of IR keyboards going to get blown out of the water again? (there were WM2003-caused incompatibilities with the PocketTop and MI drivers)

[jkendrick]

While VGA might not make a difference to some I can relate what it's done for me. In one word- productivity. I often leave my laptop at home now and just take the e805. There is no way I could do that with QVGA, it's just too hard to work with documents, spreadsheets, and web browsing otherwise.
VGA allows me to work with original Word documents via TextMaker, and see enough of the document on the screen at one time to be truly useful. Editing, reviewing, and creating Word documents is just as easy as on my laptop. Spreadsheets had been relegated to "view only" before the e805 and VGA opened that up to put enough of a worksheet on the screen at once to make productivity really possible. I use a lot of spreadsheets that are both complex in formulas and also formatting and I can bring them along with me everywhere for reference and modification. Pocket Excel is mostly OK but with limitations but PlanMaker is a boon to me. All formulas and formatting are maintained so I can work with native Excel sheets on the e805.
Landscape in VGA is useful for both spreadsheets and web browsing. I can view almost any web site with very little scrolling at all. I do not even use mobile editions of any web sites any more as I was relegated to in QVGA. I routinely maintain PocketPC Tools from my e805.
I went on a two day business trip a week ago and didn't even take my laptop. I had presentations, reports, agreements, and digital images all with me and was able to demonstrate technical points to clients from the e805. I even gave one presentation via the presentation pack.
This is not merely "cool" stuff nor "wow factor" stuff (although my clients were blown away)- this is mainstream productivity tool type stuff. The tiny controls you mention are directly addressed with SE but frankly I prefer them. The key for me is the document that's on the screen.
As with anything tech related YMMV but I believe that VGA is going to permanently change the direction of the handheld technology as it becomes apparent to a bigger audience that the PPC is not just for reference anymore.

[knelson]

I agree... I just downloaded an adobe file... to use with My Sport Training (a pretty cool pda application), anyway it was not distilled with reflow so even in landscape the file was useless on my PDA. I was not going to read and scroll every line. I do not browse much due to the screen. I am a speed reader and scrolling each line is out of the question

[Brad Isaac]

arrggh.....Acrobat for PPC makes me so mad I usually will just copy all of the text and paste it into speed reader plus to read it.

[jkendrick]

There's always Repligo or ClearVue PDF.

[knelson]

do those work pretty well? I think I have free ClearVue with my IPAQ and I have never used it.

[knelson]

It was quick view I had.